Hi Bruce,

You can measure Box 1 - Kirkpatrick and Phillips resort to control groups - but I wouldn't recommend it. To illustrate my point I use the example of training pilots how to take off and land. This is definitely must have training! Easy to measure it - just run a control group and send the new trainee pilot off without any training. Then count the cost and tell your VP how much you normally save by doing the training.

Regarding your 2nd point - I was not making a comment about leadership programmes or corporate universities but rather that they are unlikely to be very effective if not taken seriously. I agree - leadership should really be Box 1 - but that requires assessment of leadership capability before and after. Very few organisation want to grasp that nettle - only then does it slip into Box 3.
I try and keep this simple but actually, as we all know, the subject is highly complex.(I can send you a piece that explains the 3 boxes in more detail if you wish)
Hope this helps and don't worry about upsetting a Brit - fortunately we have very thick skins and a self-deprecating sense of humour! (and I'll be holidaying myself in the US this summer - unfortunately not Florida on this occasion though)

Regards


Paul

Yes, please send the more detailed description of the 3 boxes to me at bruce.wertheimer@verizon.com Your nation’s sense of humor sometimes escapes us over here. While classics like Benny Hill and Monty Python usually bridge the cultural gap between us, some shows don’t translate well into the “American” language. What would you recommend? We have 2 BBC stations on cable TV, but I rarely watch them.

Back on topic: While the control group method might not work in the pure sense, it does spark an idea. I could do a regression analysis with the independent variable being hours of training for a new service (multiple courses are offered, several of which are not required) and the dependent variable could be a performance measure (e.g., time to install, customer satisfaction, rework). Revenue generated would probably be a preferred DV from a purely capitalistic viewpoint but a poor measure because the service is rolled out in different areas at different speeds. I’m just thinking out loud. I find these discussion boards very beneficial in helping me to bounce ideas off of others and to “think out loud” especially since I have virtually no one internal in my company with whom to carry on a conversation.

Hi Bruce, I'll send the 3 Box stuff (although your email keeps returning it)but to keep this thread going - pre measurement means what it says - get business measures (the capitalistic the better) before anyone mentions the word training - using your example - have a look at 'time to install' by installer and produce a distribution curve of their performance - very interesting picture should emerge of the best and worst. Now you have a basis for doing some TNA

Regards

Paul

This message has been edited. Last edited by: Paul Kearns,

Paul - thanks. Although I haven't received anything, my email (bruce.wertheimer@verizon.com) seems to be working fine. Maybe there's a leak in an underwater cable?

Paul Kearns

For the purposes of insight and clarification would respond to the following:

1.What is business measures (the capitalistic the better)mean?

2.With reference to your 3/16/05 posting. Would you supply a successful example.

Thanks

Nero